00:01
Okay Esther, so I'm really excited that you're here because personally this is a subject matter that's increasingly frustrating for me. Excuse me. You know, there's just so much misinformation. You know, I try to be healthy. I try to do the right things. I'm not like a gym bunny or any, you know, by any means, but I try to do the basic stuff to like, you know, stay alive and live a healthy life.
And everywhere I turn around, it's like, there's either new information or the thing that I thought that I could eat is not the right thing or, you know, and honestly, half the time I'm just like, wanna put my hands up and go, okay, like, I can't win this battle, right? So I'm really glad that you're here because I know this is like what you work with people on all the time.
And I'm excited to just pick your brain and find some relief in the confusion, the madness out there. I'm so happy to be here and you nailed it. There is so much noise and so much misinformation and I'm excited to help kind of eliminate some of that and give you some really straightforward like here's what to focus on. Yeah. So let's start a little bit at the beginning.
When how did this become like something you were passionate about helping people with their health and their fitness and their nutrition? Like when did this start for you? It really started a little over 20 years ago. I found the gym myself when I was late in high school. I grew up in a small town where everybody played sports regardless of athleticism. So I played sports, but I wasn't very good at them. And as a result,
I didn't really like playing very much because I felt like there was so much pressure and I didn't like people looking at me. So when I found the gym, it felt like a really good way for me to be active and do something healthy that didn't also come with an audience. So that's what kind of got me into it. And then, you know, I was 16, 17. It also came with some more attention from boys and I just had like a really positive early experience in the gym.
02:24
So when it came time to pick a major in college, I went with exercise science, largely because I wanted to get paid to work out, which I quickly found out was not going to be the case. But after I graduated, I became a personal trainer. And that was in 2006. And it's just sort of over the last 18 years, each kind of job I've had has revealed something more I needed to learn or wanted to develop in my career.
So personal training led to nutrition coaching and better understanding kind of how those two things work together because most people want to lose weight, go to the gym, are semi -consistent and then wonder why nothing is really changing very much. That's where the nutrition piece came in was being able to help clients when they were outside of our training sessions. And then the third piece was the psychology and the behavior change.
which largely came upon because I was struggling myself. I had all of this textbook knowledge and all of this experience and I knew what to do, but I was struggling to do it. I was restricting and then I was binging. I was being really obsessive and didn't have a middle ground. So as I started diving into how we change our behaviors and why it feels so hard, it not only helped me find a place of balance and happiness.
but I realized then I could better help my clients do the same because it's really not about taking exactly what I've done and duplicating it in your own life. It's about figuring out how do I apply the things that matter the most to my lifestyle in a way that makes sense for me. So that's sort of how it's unfolded over the last couple decades. Yeah, I think that's a really great starting. Excuse me.
04:20
I think that's a really great starting point because...
Probably a lot of people can relate to the idea of knowing what to do, or at least knowing some of the things to do, right? Like eating a box of cookies. You probably don't need a science degree to figure out that that's probably not gonna work out well for you. But it is hard to stop sometimes, right? To get off the train. So...
Can you talk about a little bit what's happening there and why do we struggle with that? Because I'm willing to bet the misconception is that something's wrong with me. I'm the only person on the planet that is eating a box of Oreos right now in the quiet, suffering, embarrassed, right? But it's not really like that, is it?
Absolutely nailed it. I used to have full days of one -on -one coaching calls and literally person after person would say exactly that. I feel like I'm the only person who there must be something wrong with me because, and you hear it enough times, you're like, okay, no, none of this is personal. It's not anything wrong with you. And we do tend to blame a lack of willpower, a lack of discipline, a lack of motivation, things like that. That's rarely the issue. First and foremost.
A lot of the food that we eat today is manufactured specifically to be very delicious and very hard to stop eating. There are people in entire departments whose jobs are to say, do we want a little bit more fat? Do we want a little bit more sugar? So that, you know, instead of eating half the Pringles, you eat all of them. We are not talking enough about that.
06:17
Like that's so good what you just said, cause we really are not talking about the fact that this stuff is actually made to be addictive, right? Like there's a real, yeah. Okay, go ahead, keep going. The companies want to make money. How do they make money? By us buying more. So if you think about it, you've very seldom had an experience where you couldn't stop eating apples or you couldn't stop eating your chicken and broccoli. Like it's not that you don't, you're not able to stop eating. It's that this stuff tastes really good.
And it's packaged in such a way that it's easy to go back for more. So that's, that's one of the huge pieces of it is just let it be known that if you are a human with human taste buds, these hyper palatable processed foods are designed to make you or eat them. I think then you add to that the sort of all or nothing attitude that we often have towards food and towards movement where.
Instead of giving ourselves grace and having, you know, just, just accepting, I'm going to have a couple of Oreos maybe every day. We tell ourselves that Oreos or sub whatever your food is are bad. I shouldn't be eating them. If I have so much as, you know, a sniff of one, I've already ruined the day. So why not just eat whatever is left and then, you know, be done with it and never eat them again. And around we go. So yes, we do need to take ownership of the fact that.
No one is physically forcing this food into our bodies. And also we need to give ourselves some compassion and some understanding that this is a tough environment to be eating in. And we're always going to be, you know, we're always going to want the short -term gratification. It's really hard to say, no, I don't want this delicious thing that's in front of me right now because I want to lose 30 pounds and I'll do that in a handful of months.
So there's all sorts of these variables at play that make it hard to do, like you said, the stuff we know we should or shouldn't do. We know we shouldn't eat the whole box of Oreos. We know that we should eat more vegetables. We know we should take more walks, things like that. And there's all sorts of these lifestyle factors that contribute to that being tough to do. And it's easy to, I don't want to leave the impression that like, well, it's all out of our hands. There's nothing we can do. You do want to focus on what is within my control.
08:45
What do, you know, I can't go to Mars, you know, the company and say, stop making your food so delicious. What can I do? I can buy less of these things. I can have, I can reduce my exposure to them. I can work on taking gradual steps towards a healthier lifestyle that allows for indulgences and treats and things that I enjoy and doesn't expect perfection.
So many gems there. And something that I came up when you were speaking was that not only is this food made in such a way that it becomes really hard to resist and addictive, I think. I think we don't really talk enough about the fact that sugar, for example, is addictive. And it's in everything, right? Things that you wouldn't think sugar, you could find it in. But the other thing that came up with, it's actually really...
challenging to find healthy food. Like when you are moving about the world, there's a fast food restaurant at every corner. But if you want to have a healthy meal, it's really difficult to figure out places to go and have that, right? And when you are, even how we socialize at company parties or...
you know, family parties, like what we bring out is the junk food, right? The chips and all the stuff that's really hard to tempt. So it's another reason why it makes it really difficult to kind of navigate this, not to mention that it's so much more expensive when you're actually trying to.
You know, like getting a healthy salad can sometimes cost you more than getting a meal at McDonald's, right, with the whole thing. So there's a lot of obstacles that I do think are worth noting, as you point out. Okay, so I really want to start to give people some access on how to implement some of these healthy behaviors.
11:02
And I don't want to be like, I don't know, I'm just trying to figure out how we make this like a different conversation for them. Because what I don't want the listeners is like they've heard conversations this way. And I think my invitation is listen from a new place, you know, so that you're not just like being an automatic in this conversation, right? Does that make sense? Yeah, absolutely. I think I often.
I preface the things I say with, you've probably heard this before, but the thing to ask yourself is, am I doing it? And if so, how consistently and for how long? Because none of this is new or shocking to you. It basically boils down to, we've got to eat less junk. We've got to eat more protein, more fiber. We need to walk more, strength train more, give ourselves a chance to rest, manage stress, sleep. Those are the things. Those are the habits that are going to generate the majority of your results.
That's not new. So you're right. It is very easy to kind of dismiss it as like, yeah, yeah, I heard this before, but it's not so much the knowing what to do as am I doing it or not? And if not, why not? And not allowing yourself the excuse of, I guess I'm just lazy. I guess I'm not motivated. The, you know, something must be wrong with me route actually digging into what specific obstacles am I facing? Because you're right. There are.
lots of obstacles, but not all of them apply to all of us. So we really need to get honest with ourselves. And this is, you know, this is ownership. This is figuring out, okay, I'm not going to let myself off the hook with I'm just not motivated. Why did I hit snooze this morning after I swore up and down last night that I would wake up early and get a workout in? Why do I do that nine times out of 10? And having that sort of uncomfortable introspection.
and figure out what is the root cause. Because unless you address what's underlying your behavior or lack thereof, nothing's going to change long -term. So for a lot of us, this starts to get into, well, maybe I keep hitting snooze because I doom scroll until 1 a and then I have a hard time falling asleep. So when the alarm goes off five hours later, I'm dragging and it's the last thing I want to do. Maybe it's that I'm under mountains of stress and...
13:29
to be working out on top of that would actually not be the best thing for me. Maybe it is that I am not in the habit of following through on what I say I'm gonna do, and I need to work on that piece of it. So there's always so much more beneath the surface, and I think that's a really important takeaway for listeners is like, you do have an idea of what to do. You know better than anyone. You're in the driver's seat in your life. You know where you're not showing up for yourself and for your health the way you could be.
So you know, maybe it's snacking, maybe it's skipping meals, maybe it's, you know, just watching hours of TV. You know what kind of is the most relevant to you. So then it's a matter of actually taking ownership and saying, what's underlying that? And what am I willing to start doing differently? What do I need to learn? How do we need to change how I'm thinking? What specifically will I do to break this cycle? Because if I don't, my behavior is never going to change.
Yeah, and there's a real problem solving approach that you're kind of like, it's like, hmm, let's figure this out, right? And getting curious about the why instead of like, what's wrong with me? I'm broken. It's like, it really is like, huh, okay, well, let's get curious here and let's discover and let's see what we, yeah, I like that approach.
What are some of the common pitfalls? You work with a ton of people, so you probably get to see some patterns, right? What are some of the common pitfalls that people are falling in? Love that question. And this, I think, the first thing I'm going to say is probably relevant to 99 % of people listening. And that is the all or nothing approach that we end up taking, where we just settle into,
our norm, whatever that is, until we reach some sort of, maybe not rock bottom, but we have some sort of triggering event. We try to put on a pair of pants and we can't button them, or we have an event coming up that we want to feel more confident for. Something makes us feel like I need to do something ASAP. And because we're in such a low place, we want to overhaul everything.
15:47
That's when you get into like, I'm up at 5 a to do an hour cardio session on the treadmill, and then I drink my celery juice, and then I get a salad for lunch, and then, and we just try to do way too much. Sometimes we can sustain it for a little bit. We do start to see results, we start to feel better. But inevitably, because you have just added this whole mass of stuff on top of your already full plate, inevitably something happens. You get busy at work, a kid gets sick, you get sick, whatever.
All of a sudden you drop all the balls. It just comes crumbling down and you end up reverting back to what you had done before. So you have these spurts of doing a ton and then doing nothing where we would all be better off if we just did better most of the time. And it's not sexy. It's not glamorous. I can't package it in a, in a compelling way, but that's what it boils down to is being consistent more often than not. And to piggyback on that, the other big thing I see,
ties really well into it is when we do fall short of the perfect standard that we're expecting of ourselves, when we do hit that snooze alarm on Tuesday when we said we were going to do Monday through Friday, instead of just taking it in stride and moving forward, we fall apart. We are terribly hard on ourselves, much harder than we would be on anyone else. We make ourselves feel awful about it. And we tell ourselves, well, I already messed up or I already blew it.
So why bother the rest of the time? And that ends up just facilitating the starts and the stops. So the absolute best advice I can give you, and I know you've probably heard this before, but again, ask yourself if you're doing it, is to number one, start smaller. Pick what we do with clients is we have one exercise focus, one nutrition focus, one lifestyle focus, so that you're not spreading yourself too thin. And be realistic.
with what those expectations are. If the whole last month you worked out twice, then do not tell yourself this week you're gonna do seven days. You're just not. It's just, it's too big a jump. So look back at the last few weeks because the next few are gonna be similar. So set the bar somewhere that's step one. We're not trying to get anywhere overnight. We're trying to get you to take the first step to build some momentum, to build some confidence, to convince yourself there's not something wrong with you. And once you have that momentum, then it's easier to take the next step.
18:16
And the second piece of that is when you inevitably do slip up, fall short, make a mistake or imperfect, whatever, it's fine. Treat yourself with the same compassion and understanding you would any other person. And then see, is there something to learn from this? I do need to take ownership of my choices and of my behavior. So how do I make sure that this doesn't keep happening? And if you just.
accept your imperfections and commit to being pretty good most of the time, you are going to far outpace anybody else who's still stuck in that start and stop trap. Yeah.
Okay, let's use me as an example.
So the times that I have been the most successful is when I create this black and white line. I find that whenever there's a gray line that I'll end up inching too much to the other way. And it might just be this all or nothing mindset that you're talking about, right? But I find the times that I have been,
more successful is when I have these very hard rules, like no carbs, no dairy, no, you know, and.
19:48
And, but then what happens, what you're talking about happens, right? I get to, for me it's not the sabotaging part because, you know, as a leadership coach and I'm pretty good at like when I say I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do it, right? But it's more like when I'm done and I hit my goal, let's say my goal was, let me lose my 10 pounds, let me lose my 15 pounds. When I hit my goal and then,
I'm sort of like done. It's more like, woo, I'm free.
It's like I'm free. And then, you know, it slowly starts to creep back in all of the stuff that I had cut out. And then I end up in the cycle where I am consistently like gaining the weight and then losing the weight and gaining the weight and then losing the weight. And I never let myself get to a place where if I like...
have probably once or twice, but when it does get out of control, I know how to bring it back, right? And I've also been pretty successful at bringing it back. I mean, I'm getting older, maybe it won't be as easy now. But it is this sort of like constant yo -yo that even someone like me who's never really been obese, for example, but I am caught in this constant yo -yo of up and down, up and down in this.
constant battle between fighting my urges to want to eat every cookie to not, right? So I guess all of that to say if you want to respond to that is totally fine, but I think my question also is...
21:39
How do we start to step out of that all or nothing mindset? Because it's pretty, number one is I really don't trust myself when I'm not in that all. And then the other is I feel like so much of that is just part of the propaganda, I think, that we have been put in with all these yo -yo diets, all these fat diets, right? A thousand percent. There's so much good stuff in there.
So the first piece I want to say is if this yo -yoing is taking a psychological toll, if you feel less good about yourself when you're on the heavier end of your weight range or when you're feeling less in control of your behaviors, that is definitely something you want to address. That said, it's normal for our weight and our bodies to change over time and based on what's going on in our lives.
The same thing applies to every other aspect of our lives. If you are in a relationship, there are times when your relationship is really feeling strong and solid, and there are times where it's feeling rockier or harder or more distant. And the same goes for work and all the different things. Sometimes you're really focused on one area of your life and others kind of take the back burner. So when you say, you're talking about like say 10, 15 pounds,
Again, if it's taking a psychological toll to have that, that fluctuation, that's one thing. But if it's just you sort of living your life and like you said, you do have a system in place where you do take ownership and you do hold yourself accountable when you do start to reach that upper end of your range. Maybe that's just you having a dynamic life that doesn't always allow you the time and attention to your weight and to your body that.
you know, you would like. And as a result, maybe, you know, when you're really busy at work or when you're, you know, pursuing something new or you're developing a new program or you have a lot of new clients or whatever, that's getting more of your time and energy. And if that comes with a few extra pounds, so be it. Especially if once that area of your life is better managed, then you say, okay, now my health becomes a priority again. That's not necessarily a problem. But I think what you touched on,
24:08
about the rules and about the lack of self -trust is really what this boils down to is most people will tell me something similar of the times that I'm most successful. I have a lot of rules. It's just very black and white. I know what to do, what not to do. And it's interesting how many of us feel that way given the fact that if it was really what was making us successful, we wouldn't be doing it over and over again, because ultimately the goal is not just to do whatever it takes to lose 15 pounds and then stop.
The goal is to lose the weight, keep it off, and have that be the norm. So I would argue that for most of us, these rigid rules actually aren't what we need. And if those rules are serving you, which it does make sense that we want things to be easy. We want it to be very straightforward. When I'm faced with a choice, I want to know what to do very easily. I don't want to have to think about it a ton. That makes sense. So who came up with these rules? Are they your personal rules that make sense for you?
Or are they some rules that you picked up from the internet that you've just kind of adopted? Are they still serving you? And what is my plan to transition out of the rigidity and into something more sustainable long -term? So maybe you do say, you know what, it's super easy for me to just go super low carb, get this weight off. Once I do though, I know that that like, woohoo, I'm there moment becomes kind of the slippery slope right back where I started.
So I don't want to do that again. So how will I go from following these rules temporarily to living my life in a way that allows me to keep the weight off without all of these rules? So maybe that's a sort of a wean off program or a gradual transition where you say, okay, now I'm going to start introducing more carbs again. I'm going to show myself that I am able to go out and indulge a little bit and not have all this weight coming back on. So.
It could just be sort of more forethought into what is the, you know, kind of the plan after what's the step after I get here. And just kind of reflecting on what has happened in the past and how what needs to change so that I don't just keep living that same thing over and over again. Yeah. So you just really blew my mind. I was actually getting teary eyed.
26:34
here getting emotional, because I've never really had someone say to me that it's okay for my weight to fluctuate. And that it's a reflection of like the life that I'm living. And when you said that to me, like, it really like, I was just like, that's okay. I realized that I've been operating as if that's not okay. And it's really bad when it happens.
And I've never really given myself the permission and the space to just be and let that be without making myself wrong and judging the heck out of myself and beating myself up about it. So thank you because I've never had anyone, especially as a wellness, fitness, nutritional expert, just tell me that. And...
It feels like a weight off my shoulders. Yeah. So, wow. I had no idea I was holding that. I'm so happy to hear that. That just made my day. And thank you for sharing that. And I would imagine there are some listeners out there feeling the same way. This is what I call compassionate ownership. The acceptance of yourself and your flaws and your life and all of this. And also knowing.
I'm the one who calls the shots in my life. And any time I decide that I want to shift gears or reprioritize, I can, and I can trust myself that I will. You said it yourself. When I say I'm gonna do something, I do it. That's huge. All you need is that little bit of compassion to say, and also it's okay that I'm here right now. Yeah. Yeah, cause it's so funny, but what I wanted to point out is that all the advice that you gave,
Doesn't just apply to weight loss and health, by the way, guys. Like literally it apply, it's like I feel like, you know, it's like every coaching call I have every day, it's like that. So it's such a beautiful lesson. And I think, you know, what it is is honestly what the root of it is is we just mess with ourselves so much. Like we're just like, the constant comparison, the constant.
28:57
like judging the constant beat up is like, my God, it's exhausting. It is. You're, you're absolutely right. And it's so interesting to me because I think that think of this all the time is like, once you kind of crack the code, once you know the formula for one area of your life, all you have to do is apply it to the other areas. So you obviously have strengths in, in leadership and in coaching.
And most people just, you know, compartmentalize so well that you think like, well, I'm good at this stuff at work, but that doesn't help me here. Of course it does. You just haven't thought to apply it. So for me, it's the health stuff that makes sense. And you're exactly right. But I realized my career goals, anything else that I want to accomplish pretty much like, yes, the step, the, what to do changes a little bit, but the same principles apply. And once you have that like light bulb moment that all of this is reproducible.
It's like you're unstoppable. It's like, all right, where do I want to turn my attention to now? Because I know that I can just follow the steps and I can be successful in whatever I want. Yeah. And this idea that we're on a journey, right? Because that's really what you're saying. It's like, I'm on a journey and along the journey, sometimes my way is going to be up. Sometimes my way is going to be down. Sometimes I'm going to be feeling great. Sometimes I'm going to be really struggling. Sometimes I'm going to be, you know, have
amazing days where I bang everything out and there are gonna be days where I'm like, I don't know what the heck I did today. I can't, you know, like, but we have this like destination mindset, right? Like we get to the promised land somehow and then that's it. I'm never gonna have to deal with that again. And it really is not like that ever. Like you are, you know, the moment you climb one step, you find yourself at the bottom of the next one. So.
The more that we can adopt this journey mindset, the more grace we can have for ourselves and the more freedom we have to try different things, to play, to give ourselves grace when we eat maybe one too many cookies.
31:16
That's exactly it. And I always tell people, you know, we, we think the journey is very straightforward of here's where I am, here's where I want to be. Just like, it's got to be a straight line, right? And it's just not, and it's not a problem. It's windy and there are switchbacks and loop loops. And sometimes you think you're going in the right direction and you realize you've been going sideways. That's just part of it. And when we can accept that and we can recognize.
I will, I'm always in control of my thoughts, my efforts, my actions. And there's also a lot of stuff that is just going to kind of come at me and I will do the best that I can as those things happen. And yeah, there's no, you're right. There's no finish line. Yes, you might have a goal weight. Yes, it might be, you know, some event that you're focused on, but ultimately you want to be happy and healthy and confident for as long as physically possible, which means you need to be showing up.
for yourself in some capacity more often than not. So getting rid of that sort of finish line mentality and more having, like you said, the journey mentality of things are going to evolve and shift and change. And I can, underlying all of this is the self -trust to know that no matter what, I have my own back and I might not know what to do or how to do it, but I can trust myself to figure it out. Yeah. And I kind of want to tie together,
two things that you said. So this idea of self -trust, because I think what also happens is you, because you're caught up in, I'm gonna say fighting against these urges, fighting against this behavior, fighting against the weight, you know, for however long you're doing that, you tend to fall in a pattern of where you're not consistent with doing some of the things that you're gonna say you're gonna do.
And so when you start to form a pattern of not being consistent with the things you're gonna say you do, then trust erodes, right? Trusting yourself erodes. So now it becomes like really difficult because you have no trust in yourself. So now you're looking at Mount Everest, you don't have trust in yourself and you're wrapping your head around how the fact you're gonna climb this, it's hard. And...
33:44
But here's the thing, the only thing that puts trust back in is doing those behaviors that you're talking about, building the daily practices. And it starts out small, but if you do that every day, it will eventually build the trust muscle back up. And then when you have the trust muscle back up, well, now you can pick up heavier weight, because now you're like, okay, I got this. Now I can really do this. And then things can...
can pick up, but there's no way to bypass this process. Like the only way to, it's like you have to build a trust back up. You know? A thousand percent. And it's so interesting you guys, and listening, can't see how vigorously I was nodding, but it's fascinating to hear someone else say that because I say exactly that so often. Over time, we erode that self -trust. Enough times of saying you're gonna do something and not doing it.
you become untrustworthy. Just like if a friend keeps telling you, I'm going to pick you up and they never do. You're like, well, I'm going to stop. I'm going to stop asking. And you're right. You have to be willing to put yourself back in situations to rebuild, rebuild that trust. And the key is what we talked about a little bit ago with setting realistic goals and starting smaller. Because if you keep saying you're going to do these really lofty goals, it's great if you want to eventually get there. But.
You want to be like 90 % confident that you can do whatever you say you're going to do so that you actually do it and you get those reps under your belts and you start to be like, huh, you know what, even though these feel like seemingly small commitments, I'm following through on them. So what if it's just, I said I would drink a cup of water before I drink my coffee in the morning. So what if it's, I said I would do, you know, five minutes on the treadmill before I went to bed. It doesn't matter how small it is. It matters that you said you would do something.
And you're doing it even if you're the only person impacted. And that is that self -trust underlies everything. Yeah. You know what's fascinating? You have like, you know, you have all the science behind what you're doing and we've just spent most of our time really talking about mindset, right? And the mindset behind it. So it just really goes to show you the importance of that aspect.
36:10
You know, but let's switch gears a little bit to science. How do you feel about intermittent fasting? Great question. I think intermittent fasting can be a useful tool for some people, which I know is like a non -committal answer. But the answer was like, damn near all this stuff is it depends. And the thing with intermittent fasting is for weight loss purposes, which is why a lot of people are doing it. All it's doing is.
condensing the hours that you have available to eat, which increases the odds that you eat less. So if I used to eat from 8 a to 10 p and now I'm stopping at 7 p well, one could hope that everything that I was eating between 7 and 10, I'm no longer eating. So I could be easily getting myself into the caloric deficit necessary to lose weight. For a lot of people, it is kind of that straightforward.
You don't need to stress about the specific feeding and fasting windows. Should it be 14 hours or 16 or 18 or 20 or whatever? Ultimately, it's just making it harder to overeat. So what I always recommend is like, start with just not eating after dinner, because for the most part, we tend to eat relatively well -balanced, good size, nutritious dinners. Most people I talk to say I have some sort of protein, I have a starch, I have a veggie. Good start. So after you eat dinner at six, seven o 'clock,
the next handful of hours before you go to bed, you are very unlikely to be physically hungry. So you can help yourself out a ton by just cutting out that snacking. Brush your teeth after dinner, put your retainers in, stay out of the kitchen, just stop eating. You don't need to worry about what time you start eating in the morning or skipping meals or stuff like that. That can make a big difference right there. The other kind of side of IF is that I think because the proponents of it are so loud, as the proponents of anything tend to be, that the people who...
maybe have a negative experience with it, sort of get drowned out or don't feel comfortable expressing it. It also doesn't help a lot of people because if you look at it as license to do whatever you want in, you know, say from, from 10 AM to 8 PM, because of the hyper palatable food centric environments we live in, it's not that hard to overeat just in fewer hours. So if you're telling yourself, I skipped breakfast so I can eat whatever I want. My feeding windows open.
38:38
you could easily still be overeating. So it is certainly not magic. It works for some people, not for others. Yeah. It's been, I've been doing it for a little bit. And it's been good in terms of managing. The biggest value that I find is that what you just said, that after eight o 'clock, I'm not eating anymore. And I actually, when I reflect,
That's when a lot of the snacking was happening, right? That's when a lot of the, you stay up, you're watching TV, you end up like, you know, let's go have some ice cream. Let's go have some cookies, you know? So a lot of that was definitely happening. But I have found it, first of all, it's really great that you're saying that. I had to get my physically used to it because it, you know, I was one of these people that would get hangry.
I probably still am, but after I train my body to do intermittent fasting, I'm not as like, ready to attack when I get into that place. So I did train myself, but I have found it beneficial in terms of maintenance, right? To kind of help me keep the weight leveled off and it has been working. So I was just curious about how you felt about it.
Yeah, that's a great tool and great awareness there. Was there something I just wanted to say about it? that for people, it sounds like like yourself who do kind of like having the rules. It can be a really easy way to not be always kind of negotiating with yourself. I feel the same way. I have sort of the personal rule that I don't eat after dinner.
because I don't want to be every single day saying like, I could like go for a snack. Like we've got stuff, it would be good. It's just kind of like the decision is already made. So I think that can be really beneficial. And the thing you want to just remind yourself is to not let your, not let those rules become too rigid where you're the one who's implementing the rule, which means that you get kind of final say on when you make exceptions, when it may stop making sense. So.
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Instead of it being I never eat until, you know, the clock strikes 10, 01 AM and God forbid I'd have to spit out a bite at 8, 01 PM because it's too late. Instead of being really rigid like that, remind yourself like what is the, what is the reason that I'm doing this? I'm trying to manage my snacking, my mindless eating, trying to moderate my calories so I can maintain my weight relatively easily. Okay. So it's less the exact hours and it's more kind of the principle of it.
So say you're traveling and you are on the flight and you land and you're starving, but it's later than you normally eat. You get to have the final say on, you know what? An exception would make sense here. And I know I'm not going to let this turn into a slippery slope where now I never intermittent fast anymore. It's just that right now, today, it wouldn't make sense. So I think working on that sort of that gray area, like you said, the gray is hard.
practicing the gray to remind yourself that I don't want to become a slave to this tool because I'm the one who's using it and I can decide when it makes sense and when it doesn't. I love that. Love that. Okay, so as we start to wrap up, I think it would be, you know, helpful to kind of walk them through some of the ways that you help people as well because I know that sometimes...
Look, I think one of the ways that people struggle with this stuff is they're trying to do it on their own and suffering on their own and going through the embarrassment. And the instinct is to be ashamed of this stuff, right? So when you're feeling shame, you hide. And so all of that just sucks the power out of you being able to take ownership over it.
So one of the resources is to work with someone like you to get the support and not just the support, but I think something that's really powerful is community. And I know that you have a coaching program where there is some community created. So maybe you can just talk a little bit about what happens there so people just know that they have that resource available. Yeah, thank you so much for asking. And you absolutely nailed it. Yes, the mentorship, the support, the guidance, the accountability, all of that.
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helps. And I used to be one of those stubborn people who was like, I shouldn't need help. I should be able to do it on my own. It's just so much better when you're not. And sure, you can do it on your own, but are you? How long will it take? What will the process be like? If you knew you could expedite the process and be more successful faster, why wouldn't you? That's what, that's what coaching is. And you're absolutely right about the benefits of community and normalizing these conversations.
having access to other people who were also previously saying, I feel like I'm the only person who, and realizing, huh, you know what, I must not be. This must just be part of the human experience, and you feel less alone. That's a huge part of it. We also, our coaching includes the exercise and nutrition stuff. So strength training workouts, the sort of guidelines for putting together your own framework, the...
nutrition targets for like how much should I be eating and what should I be eating, recipes, all of that. And the kind of massive stuff beneath the surface that we've been talking about is we help you identify the challenges and develop the skills and the tools you need to address whatever is underlying your lack of consistency. And those three things, simplifying the what to do's, having the support and the community.
and having the mindset and the willingness to sort of go where the process takes you and develop as a person the way you need to are what we include in our programming. But like you said, are the exact components to reaching any goal successfully. Yeah, I love that. Well, we'll put the link to your program on the show notes. So if anybody wants to.
learn more about that and look into it, that'll definitely be available there. And I know you have a gift for our listeners who maybe are not ready to jump into a program but wanna get more of you. Yes, I would love for you to download my Big Rocks Habit Tracker. So we sort of alluded to these in the beginning, basically the handful of behaviors that generate the majority of your results. So.
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walking more, strength training, eating your protein, eating your fiber, et cetera. If you focus on just those, you will be incredibly successful and not overwhelmed. And one of the first steps is to just start documenting how often am I doing these things? Some you're probably doing really well, some you might not realize, you know, maybe you're doing pretty well Monday through Thursday, and then the tail end of the week, you fall apart. So the consistency tracker will break down.
what the Big Rock habits are and where to sort of set the bar for yourself. And it also has a printable calendar that you can use to actually physically check off, did I do these things today? So that you can get sort of that big picture view on where are my strengths, where are my opportunities, and what am I going to do now that I have the awareness? So please download that, use it. I use it myself anytime I'm trying to implement a new habit because having that physical thing to look at and to interact with is really important.
really, really helpful at establishing a new behavior. Yeah, it's so good because it really is like, I know it sounds simple guys, but it really, really is a matter of behaviors and practices and habits. It really, really is. I promise you, it's like you're just not sticking it out long enough for it to become a habit. But if you just like create a structure like this where you are tracking.
you taking those actions on a daily basis, not just, let me see if I remember to do it. It will eventually become a habit. And then you can really like rock and roll. But until then, you gotta just keep doing the daily check it off. Did I do it? Did I do it? Did I do it? That goes for anything. Not just weight loss. It goes for anything. Completely agree. Could not have said it better myself. my goodness. And you have a podcast too, don't you?
I do, yes, it's called Live Diet Free. Live Diet Free, okay, well definitely go check out Esther's podcast, Live Diet Free. The link to her daily habit tracker will be in the show notes and to her group program as well. Esther, it's been so lovely having you on the show. Thank you so much for coming over and talking to us and I hope to see you here again. Thank you so much, this has been an awesome interview.
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Thank you.